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    August 28th, 2012 @ 11:35 am by Kevin

    In light of my recent blog posts addressing what I see as significant problems inherent in Reformed Christianity, penal substitution views of the atonement and the like, I thought it might be helpful to post this outtake from Brian McLaren’s Hellbound? interview. Enjoy!

    Is God Violent? Brian McLaren gives his POV from Kevin Miller on Vimeo.



leave a comment on this post (8 Comments)

  1. Maybe the most important question to ask is how Jesus interpreted his holy scriptures. The resurrected Jesus explains the Scriptures to two of his followers. We aren’t told exactly how he explained the scriptures, or what exactly he said, but the fact that Scriptures needs explanation is important for us. I think we can only assume that Jesus’ explanation of the Scriptures is consistent with the forgiveness and peace that the resurrected Jesus offers to those who betrayed him. When it comes to interpreting the Old and New Testaments, that Jesus explanation of forgiveness and peace is a game changer.

  2. I’ve demanded Hellbound in Hickory, NC and I know of at least four others who have demanded it with me. The problem is… when I go to the demand Hellbound site, it still says that only one person has demanded it. I’m wondering if you are getting proper records… I’m just trying to do all I can to make sure we get to see the movie somewhere in the Hickory area…

  3. I’ve enjoyed reading “Hope Beyond Hell” by Gerry Beauchemin and other books of research that I have studied such as “Christ Triumphant”, by Thomas Allin (19th century Church of England minister and scholar), that reveal the truth of U/R-THE ULTIMATE AND UNIVERSAL RECONCILIATION OF ALL. The Literal Translation of the Bible confirms this, and the overwhelming majority of the Church Fathers in the primative, Apostolic Church (Catholic means Universal in Latin) taught and believed U/R for the first 5 centuries of church history (although some of the Church Fathers believed in keeping the final universal reconciliation in “reserve” for the “esoteric scholarly saints”, for fear that this truth might lead to more evil and crimes amoung the heathen–using a scripture, “don’t cast your pearls before swine”, as a reason).

    I first came to this Truth in 1971, after finding and studying: “Young’s Literal Translation of the Bible and “Young’s Analytical Concordance of the Bible”. The Holy Spirit led me to this “Apostolic Truth”, and has given me perfect assurance–”but when comes that One, The Spirit of Truth, He will guide you into all truth…”John 16:13. Years of intense research have only confirmed what the Primative Apostolic Church taught and believed.

    I only hope that this movie (whatever it depicts Hell as) will not mislead people into thinking that there is no Hell at all–that Hell is only unconsciouness in the grave. The Bible does not teach this, neither did the Primative Church; but that Hell is a real place to purge away sinfulness, evils, and wickedness–not punish souls forever!

    • Ronald. I’m curious. In your studies did you become aware of the Muratorium Fragments, being the earliest “canon” of the Bible from around the second century, which included the Apocalypse of Peter as inspired scripture. This text clearly and irrefutably says that the punishments are for a set period of time and that everyone will eventually end up in heaven. I’m not arguing that this text is inspired scripture. But these early Christians clearly thought that a text which declared the eventual salvation of all was to be included in their Bibles.

      • To Christopher: All church-era “apocalyptic” genre literature (such as the Apoc. of Peter, Apoc. of Paul, the Book of Enoch, the Vision of Ezra or 4th Ezra, any other inter-testament books between Malachi and the NT, and yes, even the Book of Revelation) were considered non-canonical after much scholarly research and comparison with all other Scriptures at the Council of Laodicea in approx. 360 AD. This Council was just 35 years after the Council of Nicea and was the first Council to list all the books of our current Protestant Bible–except the Book of Revelation, which was considered by many as dubious and ambiguous, and not thought to have been written by the Apostle John. The Book of Revelation was not included in the earliest Greek New Testaments, nor in the Aramaic or Syriac Peshitta. It wasn’t accepted in the Latin Canon until the 10th Century, when the approach of the new millennium brought new interest. The Book of Revelation is not read in Orthodox and other Eastern Church services even today. We don’t need the Book of Revelation–all the prophecies of the OT and prophecies of Christ and the Apostles in the NT are enough. The Deuterocanonical Apocrypha (or subsequent canon) was added several centuries later in the Roman Catholic Church and is also recognized as such in the Orthodox churches. Several of the books in the Apocrypha have been considered valuable historical and devotional literature down through all centuries–but not canonical by the ancient Council of Laodicea, by many ancient saints, or by nearly all Protestant churches. Luther’s Bible, the Geneva Bible, and earlier English Bibles had several books of the Apocrypha in a separate appendix. I hope that this has been helpful to you. (p.s.–I found a good book critiquing the Book of Revelation that you can read online at Christian Classics Ethereal Library. The Title is: “History of the Origins of Christianity. Book IV. The Antichrist” by Renan, Joseph Ernest (1823-1892)–He finds a similarity between Revelation and other apocalyptic books such as 4th Ezra.

        • Hi Ronald. Yes I’m familiar with much of this. My argument wasn’t whether or not this text was considered scripture but that it was included in the Bibles of at least some early Christians which would show that they believed in Ultimate Reconciliation and in this didn’t consider it to be contrary to other Biblical texts.

  4. Psalm 145:8
    The LORD is gracious and compassionate, slow to anger and rich in love. SLOW to anger!

    Okay; when ‘hellfire preachers’ say that God’s wrath “abides” on sinners, this would imply that God’s wrath is about to explode at any second. how does this jive? the wrath verses(john 3?) would have to imply that God WAS slow to get angry but that was long ago and now he’s always mad.

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